[meteorite-list] FW: High Noon!

[John Teague]

Well, sure Mike,  why use reason and logic in this 'debate'?!?  Where would the world be if we all did that?

This 'debate' is why I NO LONGER suggest this list to my customers at shows.  I have had too many of them come back and ask why I had "meteorite-list" on my handout of website information for customers.  I received so many negative comments/complaints about petty bickering (and NOT so petty!) that I've removed it.

I keep asking myself "Why do I continue to subscribe?"  It is getting harder and harder to come up with a valid reason ... just stubborn I guess!

Just my two coppers worth ...

John


-----Original Message-----
>From: Michael Gilmer <meteoritemike at gmail.com>
>Sent: Sep 6, 2011 3:48 PM
>To: Marc Fries <fries at psi.edu>
>Cc: Adam <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
>Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] FW: High Noon!
>
>Hi Gang,
>
>I don't have a dog in this fight, but I think one simple fact is being
>overlooked by almost everyone involved here, and this simple criteria
>is the ultimate litmus test that definitively confirm or deny a
>terrestrial origin for a given sample...
>
>
>Drumroll please....
>
>Cosmic ray exposure data.  Elemental analysis is fine and dandy, and
>it can answer many questions, but it cannot definitively confirm or
>deny the terrestrial (or meteoritic) origin for a sample.  It simply
>states what elements are present in the sample and in what
>concentrations (within a margin of error) these elements are present.
>As we all know, some lunar and martian meteorites are very similar in
>elemental composition to their terrestrial analogs.  But, terrestrial
>rocks have never been exposed to cosmic rays.  By contrast, all
>meteorites have been exposed to cosmic rays during their journey from
>the parent body to Earth.  This exposure leaves tell-tale markers in
>the material.
>
>Of course, I am over-simplifying to some degree, and the cosmic ray
>exposure clock can be reset by certain events, but those events also
>leave their own signatures.
>
>Simple XRF analysis, and/or visual comparisons will not cut it to make
>a truly definitive and authoritative judgement on the origins of a
>rock.
>
>Run cosmic ray exposure studies on the material in question - if it
>was exposed to cosmic rays, then that material has spent time outside
>of Earth's protective shield.  Once that has been established, then
>the samples can be subjected to SEM (scanning electron microprobe) to
>determine the composition of the material to a more accurate and
>specific degree than the XRF will reveal.
>
>Best regards,
>
>MikeG
>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Galactic Stone & Ironworks - Meteorites & Amber (Michael Gilmer)
>
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>
>On 9/6/11, Marc Fries <fries at psi.edu> wrote:
>> Oh come on, Adam!  Clearly the good Sheriff is an expert at identifying
>> Martian meteorites.
>>
>> The only non-awesome part of that email was how I was somehow left off the
>> Thinks Steve Curry is a Moron list.  I feel cheated.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Marc Fries
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Sep 6, 2011, at 1:16 PM, Adam Hupe <raremeteorites at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi List,
>>>
>>> I would suggest deleting Steve C.s emails from now on.
>>>
>>>
>>> Steve got exactly what he was after now that this garbage has been posted
>>> to the List.  His San Juan breccia has already been studied and denounced
>>> by the most qualified laboratories. He refuses to follow the same channels
>>> the rest of us have to in order to make meteorites official.  For some
>>> reason, possibly watching too much television, he thinks that he is better
>>> than everybody else, can set his own rules and become an instant
>>> millionaire.  Sorry, Steve, despite what the voices in your head might be
>>> telling you, your gaggle of "Moon Rocks" is not better than the NASA
>>> Apollo returned collection!
>>>
>>> He now wants more attention with this fake showdown which will accomplish
>>> nothing because the results would not be what he wants to hear or believe.
>>> He has the nerve to question the integrity of the best planetary
>>> scientists in the world in his latest ramblings.  He now thinks by
>>> comparing his terrestrial rocks to best lunar meteorite in the world that
>>> he can gain even more notoriety. He does not deserve any more attention.
>>> I will certainly not degrade a piece of real NWA 5K by engaging in this
>>> ridiculous "High Noon" challenge.
>>>
>>>
>>> My challenge to Stevy is how many "Denver Death Cookies" can he drink at
>>> Denver show at Teddy's Bar?
>>>
>>> Enough of this crap already,
>>>
>>> Adam
>>>
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>
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