[meteorite-list] Scam Artist - Joel Samson -FakeLunar Meteorites

Thu May 12 21:12:37 EDT 2011

Hello Don, Al, Chris and List,

We agree that something needs to be done to eliminate fraud and misidentification. We also agree that investigating and "outing" a person offering misidentified meteorites intentionally, or not, is fraught with the danger of a lawsuit.

I put this to the you and the List...Why attack the purported fraudster? Why not attack the meteorite being offered? We are going to examine the suspected "clinger" anyway. 

It could work this way.... and you readers can fill in the details.... Suspect rock is offered. Sample is obtained for analysis. This act would tie the seller to the rock. Rock turns out to be genuine. Nothing done. Rock turms out to be something else. Then the results of the analysis is released to the seller, the buyer and all who have asked that they be notified of misrepresentations. Nothing needs to be said about the seller personally. His rock is shit and we all know it. Whether his offering was done to intentionally defraud, or if he was a victim, or if it was mis-classified can be handled in the details. Just don't attack the seller personally. Attack the rock.

Best to all,

Count Deiro
IMCA 3536     

-----Original Message-----
>From: Don Merchant <dmerchan at rochester.rr.com>
>Sent: May 12, 2011 5:06 PM
>To: al mitt <almitt at kconline.com>, Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
>Cc: Chris Spratt <cspratt at islandnet.com>
>Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Scam Artist - Joel Samson -FakeLunar	Meteorites
>
>Hi Al and the rest of the List. I agree totally with you Al. One thing as 
>you mentioned that I have noticed over the years is that there is that 
>chance someone can get hurt by accusations of fraud ect. Yet how can this be 
>done so as to avoid this? I have an idea that might work but may need 
>refining. Maybe we can ask the List for 2 or 3 volunteers who 1) Has been a 
>Listie of good and long standing. 2) Has built an excellent reputation of 
>their name in the meteorite community, which includes experience with buying 
>and selling meteorites, with knowledge of meteorite composition both 
>internal and external. 3) Last but not least, always desired to be a CSI and 
>so a great opportunity to be an MFI or Meteorite Fraud Investigator. I 
>myself like MFS "Meteorite Fraud Squasher!" Anyways...The List could vote 2 
>or 3 MFI's that have an interest. How this vote could be done....I don't 
>know, but I am sure with all the brilliant minds that this List has, that a 
>great suggestion is out there. These would be the people that the rest of 
>the List would contact (via another email) when a fraudulent situation takes 
>place. Now the rest of the List is not exposed to any allegation. The MFI's 
>would research the history of the suspected Dealer/Seller in a fair timely 
>fashion and communicate with the other 2 MFI's of their findings. Finally if 
>the situation is found to NOT be fraudulent, the MFI's need only contact the 
>person that thought fraud was taking place and explain their findings. Now 
>all is calm on the List. If however the findings show fraud (several very 
>strong circumstantial evidences could warrant fraud) Then the MFI's could 
>officially announce this to the List! Though the IMCA does something 
>similar, not everyone on this List is a Member of the IMCA. It would be 
>beneficial anyways, in having 2 entities helping to combat the destruction 
>of our collections and reputations as meteorite collectors, sellers, 
>dealers, and hunters, especially since the Meteorite Central List doesn't 
>appear to be going away for a very long time if ever. Maybe a bi-monthly or 
>monthly email to the entire List as a reminder of who to contact (MFI's) if 
>fraud is suspected. We need to all watch our backs. It will only get worse. 
>Lets not allow differences between dealers and or mistakes stand in the way 
>but rather concentrate on the benefit for all of us, to rid of this pandemic 
>air borne disease of meteorite fraud. This hurts every single collector on 
>this List, whether I like you or you don't like me bla bla bla...the bottom 
>line is we have a common interest and that is the love of this great hobby. 
>Lets protect it. Just my 2 cents is all. I know it sounds silly, but the 
>bottom line is Al is right, and somehow we need to stomp out these "greedy 
>meteorite flea fakes!" Say that 3 times fast! It's FAKES not FLAKES lol
>Sincerely
>Don Merchant
>Founder-Cosmic Treasures Celestial Wonders
> http://www.ctreasurescwonders.com/index.html
>IMCA #0960
>----- Original Message ----- 
>From: "al mitt" <almitt at kconline.com>
>To: <Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
>Cc: "Chris Spratt" <cspratt at islandnet.com>
>Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2011 7:57 AM
>Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Scam Artist - Joel Samson -FakeLunar 
>Meteorites
>
>
>> Hi Gary, Greg H., Chris and all,
>>
>> Two names have come up recently as scammers. Joel Samson and Todd Parker. 
>> We
>> also know of another guy from the Chicago area that is a fraud. What I 
>> would
>> like to see is a list of people and companies that are known to be selling
>> fakes, mis-representing material and so forth. I am not talking about
>> someone who has made a mistake.
>>
>> In order to qualify, the person or company in question would have to have
>> evidence that would support their efforts to be purposely doing something
>> wrong. I wouldn't want a witch hunt or dealers who don't like other 
>> dealers,
>> trying to put people on this list. I know this is probably going to open a
>> can of worms BUT it is important to know suspect con artists, frauds and
>> people and companies who are just not getting the fact we don't like our
>> collections messed up.
>>
>> Does a list already exist? If not it sure would be nice to have one that
>> could be shared with the collecting community from time to time. Other 
>> input
>> appreciated.
>>
>> --AL Mitterling
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Gary Fujihara" <fujmon at mac.com>
>> To: "Chris Spratt" <cspratt at islandnet.com>
>> Cc: <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2011 3:41 PM
>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Scam Artist - Joel Samson - FakeLunar
>> Meteorites
>>
>>
>>> I've asked the administrator of the Meteorites group on Facebook to 
>>> remove
>>> this person from the group.  Hopefully this will put a damper on his
>>> shenanigans, but probably nothing short of legal action will make him
>>> cease and desist.
>>>
>>> gary
>>>
>>> On May 11, 2011, at 8:50 AM, Chris Spratt wrote:
>>>
>>>> Never was my friend on Facebook yet he managed to post things in a group
>>>> I belong to. Is there a way to unfriend someone from a group?
>>>>
>>>> Chris Spratt
>>>> (Via my iPhone)
>>>> ______________________________________________
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>>>
>>> Gary Fujihara
>>> Big Kahuna Meteorites (IMCA#1693)
>>> 105 Puhili Place, Hilo, Hawai'i 96720
>>> http://bigkahuna-meteorites.com/
>>> http://shop.ebay.com/fujmon/m.html
>>> (808) 640-9161
>>>
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>>
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