AW: AW: [meteorite-list] Re: 13.5 kg lunar

[MexicoDoug at aol.com]

Hola Norbert,

No need to ask for pardon  Norbert, especially since in your heart you feel 
you meant no offense.  I  never saw any offense = I saw a simple statement 
which I agreed with in the  first half (a lament not to be able to bond with the 
new Lunar), but I am in  vigorous disagreement with your statement's second 
part, which I feel is the  root of what rubs people the wrong way and hurts 
confidence about meteorite  dealers:

"[1]For now, all I can say is that I'm a bit sad that it will  virtually be
impossible to get a specimen of this whopper, and its smaller  anorthositic
sister. The finder is obviously intending to keep the entire  masses, and to
stay anonymous... [2]Maybe there's a good part to that sad  news, too, and 
that
is that this whopper probably won't ruin the lunar market  - for what it's
worth..."

It sure sounded to me like you were saying  "the good part...is that this 
whopper probably won't ruin the Lunar market - for  what it's worth."  The Holy 
Roman Empire didn't take long to give you "all  the reason" (translation: you 
are totally correct about the "ruin ruin ruin" and  I honestly don't think he 
is capable of reading between the lines given the  challenges he faces in 
expressing himself)

I will accept as a valid  interpretation all of your criticisms where I feel 
you may have read between my  lines in your reply as well, which as far as I 
can tell amount to me  artificially separating the "Lunar haves" and "Lunar 
have nots", misclassifying  you as a "have", and harboring biases I am unaware I 
have.

I won't  comment on your personal situation, we've already seen one round of 
that on the  list and it was ugly - the only time it worked was in the movies 
when Indiana  Jones compares his scars with a cocky she-raider, not by public 
posting on our  relative hardships... I will chalk up the my entire reply as 
an unwarranted  reaction to your "good part being this whopper probably won't 
ruin the Lunar  market" - accepting on faith whatever then that means to you 
and however you  justify in your heart to mean you would like to see the price 
levels come down  and are not protectionist.  I personally would love to have a 
driveway, and  then to pave it with CV3's or better yet, CM2's - they look 
just like  asphalt.  Of course, no one could drive on it and it would have a 
roof and  a funhouse mirror maze set up on it for the whole neighborhood even if 
everyone  else's houses were LBS and MBS (Lunar and Martian Block Stucco)  
construction.

Every little meteorite I have the priviledge of caring for,  including the 
most spectacular exception I am in heaven about currently in AZ,  has no price 
tag any more.  And if every one became worthless I would  hardly notice and 
still feel priviledged to be their custodian.  Thank  goodness there are folks 
like Walter, Darren, JKG, Ingo, and even to a point,  Marcin and maybe Greg are 
there in replies to this topic.  And Matteo, the  only contrarian voice might 
check out what his friend Michael Blood had as a  viewpoint if I recall, he 
once mentioned he didn't care what prices were, as he  was confident he could 
always add value and things would work out in the  end.  Or something like that 
I am sure it sounds better coming from  the source's mouth.

There is the little detail of haves and have  nots and thousand-dollar a gram 
speculations.  A have not cannot  participate in that, lets not beat around 
the bush.  We can make an  exception for those with obsessive-compulsive 
collector behavior if you like, I  guess though they would be best off skipping 
dinner to pay the  psychiatrist.  But you do need big bucks to be involved I hope 
you  recognize.

Please don't give up that ambition and dream to go to the  Moon.  Norbert, 
wasn't it Iceman that told Maverick "You can be my Wingman  anytime!" ;-), and 
Matteo, was it Stinger who told him, "Son, your ego is  writing checks your 
body can't cash?"
Saludos, Doug 


En un mensaje  con fecha 05/14/2005 6:15:03 PM Mexico Daylight Time, 
trifid at timewarp.de  escribe:
MexicoDoug wrote:

> Hola Norbert,  I fail to see why  you perceive a silver lining by 
> preventing Lunar specimens to become  accessible to the hands of amazed 
> parent enthusiasts and collectors and  the wonder of inspiring its 
> wondrous effects with kids alike.   What possible reason other than 
> the desire to control or monopolize  could you possibly be thinking??  

Good evening Doug. I'm surprised  by all the things that you read between
the lines. Did I somehow offend you  with my email? If yes, I beg your
pardon, it wasn't intended to be offensive.  I've no desire to control nor to
monopolize anything. I was just expressing  some mixed feelings (yes, you
quoted me out of context).

> Some of  us aren't speculators, you know and truly are excluded on 
> the base of  price. We are appreciate the possibility of an occasional
> Zagami  incident. We have managed to be smiling all along without getting
>  envious.  

Are you trying to set up some "us and them" scenario  here? Rich vs poor?
True collector vs spoiled investor? If so, you're picking  at the wrong guy
since I'm no member of the "big boy's fraction" - in fact,  I'm wearing no
party's color. I worked very hard for each and every piece  that I have in my
collection, just to fulfill a dream, and surely not to  compromise other
collectors. I'm driving a ten year old worn car, I'm writing  this mail on a
five year old laptop as I'm always saving my hard earned bucks  for another
meteorite sample - just to follow a dream. So don't tell  me:

> Your post indicates that if you decided, you would like  material
> available, but only for those who happen to have a huge  purse...

I never said that, and you know that I never did. Reading  between the lines
is a strange thing, Doug. It's a bit like gazing into a  mirror, especially
when you don't know who's or what's on the other side. You  don't know me,
Doug, and thus all what you seem to be reading between the  lines, IMHO, is
the projection of your own bias.

> And within 20  years after, much fresher Lunar specimens at the price of 
> gold will  be  commonplace...for those of us still around. In the mean
> time,  how nice  that this finder seems to be happy to share the meteorite
>  with scientists! hat is the best start...

To keep this on topic, I agree  with the latter statement, but I tend to
disagree with the first. Meteoritics  is always science first, but I really
doubt that we will have enough kerosene  left in about 20 years to warrant
cheap private expeditions to the Moon, and  back. Again, don't get me wrong:
I actually have mixed feelings about that,  too, and I really would enjoy a
trip to the Moon, and to hunt for rocks, and  meteorites up there when I'm
65. It's a nice dream, but two steps too far  away to follow.

Best,
Norbert