[meteorite-list] High Noon!

[MexicoDoug]

Hi Steve,

One thing I am unsure of after hearing all this.  Are you representing 
that your material (the stuff described by you as Lunar) is 
*unequivocably Lunar*, or just that it is *either Lunar or Terrestrial 
but similar to Lunar*?  Isn't that the important question to answer?

Great to hear your side of this first hand finally!  As one who cannot 
go to Colorado to witness this epic duel, could you kindly comment on 
what control samples (Earth rocks) will be used during the proposed 
show-down with the XRF, and exactly what is the hypothesis being tested 
(i.e., that they are Lunar? or that by picking and choosing your 
analysis parameters you can make the point that they share some common 
characteristics ?

For example, aluminum and glass both have a density of 2.7 cubic 
centimeters.

If I set up a test saying I will prove aluminum and glass are the same 
thing by checking their density, I am picking the parameters and if 
someone says, lets check if it is an electrical conductor or insultor 
and I say, no!, it's over...

then, what is the point and who would participate in such a duel, if 
all you are willing to define as aluminum is anthing with a density of 
2.7 g/cm^3?

Why not just submit your specimen to a Meteoritical Society approved 
scientist (like Hupe did for NWA 5000) and get it scientifically 
authenticated by just one independent scientist for publication in the 
Meteoritical Bulletin - this is what every other meteorite finder does. 
  Then you'd be done with it!  The MetSoc is independent of the IMCA so 
there is no conflict there.

If for some reason there is a problem with that, can you explain why 
you don't do that?  That is the issue I cannot understand, and which 
tends to have others question the material's provnance.

What will the duel prove scientifically if you determine which 
parameters and only which parameters are tested, and how they are 
tested and do not leave the testing open to peer review which is a 
necessary part of the scientific authentication process?

Informally, if you can post a picture of a specimen with obvious fusion 
crust you could probably gain favor on this list.  Do you have such a 
picture you are willing to post?

Kindest wishes and good luck
Doug




-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Curry <cwheileg at gmail.com>
To: wahlperry <wahlperry at aol.com>; Walter L. Newton 
<newton at acrossthebow.com>; mexicodoug <mexicodoug at aim.com>; countdeiro 
<countdeiro at earthlink.net>; daistiho <daistiho at hotmail.com>; 
stlouismeteorites <stlouismeteorites at gmail.com>; raremeteorites 
<raremeteorites at yahoo.com>; meteorite-list 
<meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>; JoshuaTreeMuseum 
<joshuatreemuseum at embarqmail.com>; yeomega <yeomega at gmail.com>; 
mikestang <mikestang at gmail.com>; star_wars_collector 
<star_wars_collector at yahoo.com>; gmhupe <gmhupe at centurylink.net>; 
daniel_wray <daniel_wray at comcast.net>; sterling_k_webb 
<sterling_k_webb at sbcglobal.net>; stevenarnold60120 
<stevenarnold60120 at yahoo.com>; axolotyis <axolotyis at gmail.com>; Randy 
Korotev <korotev at wustl.edu>; Randy L. Korotev <rlk at levee.wustl.edu>; 
John Wasson <jtwasson at ucla.edu>; James Wittke <James.Wittke at nau.edu>; 
Roger Warin <roger.warin at skynet.be>; Ken Newton 
<magellon.ken at gmail.com>; Stuart McDaniel 
<actionshooting at carolina.rr.com>; Dr. Michael Zolensky 
<michael.e.zolensky at nasa.gov>; Dr. Timothy McCoy <mccoyt at si.edu>; Maria 
Haas <dragonsoup at msn.com>; Anne Black <IMPACTIKA at AOL.COM>; Carl Agee 
<agee at unm.edu>; Chris A. Peterson <prpdc at higp.hawaii.edu>; Dr. Alex 
Ruzicka <ruzickaa at pdx.edu>; Tim Stout <tim_97124 at yahoo.com>; Galactic 
Stone & Ironworks <meteoritemike at gmail.com>; kevin.righter-1 
<kevin.righter-1 at nasa.gov>; Rainer Newberry <rjnewberry at alaska.edu>; 
Ted Bunch <tbear1 at cableone.net>; ontheroad <ontheroad at usairborne.com>; 
Moto Ito <ito at lpi.usra.edu>; Tomasz Jakubowski <illaenus at wp.pl>; Ian A. 
Franchi <I.A.Franchi at open.ac.uk>; Zeus Crankypants 
<zeus.crankypants at yahoo.com>; Catherine (Cari) Corrigan 
<corriganc at si.edu>; Matthew Benjamin <matthew.benjamin at colorado.edu>; 
lebofsky <lebofsky at lpl.arizona.edu>
Sent: Tue, Sep 6, 2011 12:24 pm
Subject: High Noon!


Hi Boys & Girls;  You've all had a wonderful time, over past couple of 
years, in trying to denounce my research, attacking my integrity, 
defaming my character, and, most importantly, making absolute fools of 
yourselves!  I've allowed this, and I've exhibited a great deal of 
tolerance for your highly unprofessional, and grossly unethical 
behavior, but, I will not tolerate your abuse of my family, friends, 
and business colleagues.  YOU HAVE CROSSED THE LINE FOR THE LAST TIME!! 
    As an organization, that explicitly demands behavior above & beyond 
reproach, it is quite apparent, that the IMCA does not enforce its own 
policies.  Each & every member of this organization needs to hang their 
heads low, in shame, for allowing the Administration of the IMCA to 
engage, support, and condone this type of behavior by its membership.
    This is not to say, that all members of the IMCA, exhibit this 
abhorrent behavior.  I trust, that there are many members of high 
integrity, honesty, sincerity, and commitment to the many sciences 
surrounding meteoritics.  To those members, I ask that you take a stand 
against those members, who have treated this organization with such 
selfish disdain, and disregard of its charter.


    IMCA member, Adam Hupe, recently raised a flag of protest, over my 
use of the term, "NWA 5000," in comparing our "Uncompahgre Lunar 
Feldspathic Breccia" meteorite to his prized possession, purchased from 
a Moroccan dealer.  Mr. Hupe seems to think the "NWA 5000" is, somehow, 
a title deserving of a Trademark!  For starters, "Northwest Africa" is 
by geographical location & description, in "Public Domain!"  "5000" is 
merely an integer, or number, and cannot be trademarked.  It, too, is 
considered "Public Domain!"  The US Trademark Office would, simply, 
laugh at Mr. Hupe's submission.  It would not get any more embarrassing 
for Mr. Hupe, than this!


   If Mr. Hupe, and other IMCA members, would like to end this, once 
and for all, here is my challenge, and I will not accept any 
substitutions, alterations, or changes, to this challenge.  You can, 
also, trust, that this challenge this will be fair, and without bias, 
or prejudice.  Unlike you folks, I play by the rules, and I play fair, 
and honestly!  You can trust, too, that the stakes are extremely high!


    Just for sport, I'm going to name this game, "HIGH NOON IN WESTERN 
COLORADO!"..........Even though, this dual will be held in the evening.
    I am giving a meteorite lecture & seminar at the Delta County 
Library, on September 20, 2011, @ 6:00pm.  If Mr. Hupe can trust his 
fellow IMCA member, Blaine Reed, Mr. Hupe is to send a specimen sample 
of the "NWA 5000" to Mr. Reed.  Mr. Blain Reed must show up at this 
lecture, armed with his new toy, as in his XRF hand-held analyzer.  I, 
too, will show up with our XRF hand-held analyzer, which will be 
operated by an experienced geologist from Western Colorado.
   Mr. Reed, and our geologist, will conduct XRF analysis on both the 
"NWA 5000," and our "Uncompahgre Lunar Feldspathic Breccia."  Both 
stones will be analyzed using the "Precious Metal Mode," and the 
"Prospector Mode," which will produce elemental percentages, and 
elemental PPM's (Parts-per-Million).  The results from Mr. Reed, and 
our geologist, will be recorded by a officer from the Delta County 
Sheriff's office, which is next door to the library.  
   The analysis will, then, be compared by a jury of 12 men & women, in 
our audience, to those figures obtained from NASA's Apollo Lunar Sample 
Atlas, and the Lunar & Planetary Institute's "Lunar Meteorite 
Compendium."  Comparisons will be acceptable, should the results of the 
analysis 's within +(-) 5% of NASA's, and LPI's elemental chemistry, 
posted on these official sites.  The Delta County Sheriff will review & 
tally the decisions of the 12 jurors, and confirm their findings.
   Once the findings are tallied and authenticated, the Sheriff will 
pronounce the decision of these jurors.  Should it be found, that our 
"Uncompahgre Lunar Feldspathic Breccia" is, in fact, a similar match to 
Mr. Hupe's "NWA 5000," and similar to the data published on the NASA, 
and LPI website, I will demand that the following individuals put their 
reputations & careers where their mouths have been!


1).  Mr. Hupe, will, within 72 hours of being advised of the Sheriff's 
announcement, submit a "Public Letter of Apology," to Mr. Curry, his 
family, and colleagues.  Mr. Hupe will, then, submit a "Letter of 
Resignation" to the IMCA, effective IMMEDIATELY!  Mr. Hupe will, also, 
issue an "Affidavit," stating that he will never, ever, sell, buy, 
trade, or barter meteorites in the United States, or elsewhere, for as 
long as he may live!
2).  Anne Black, the current President of the IMCA, will tender her 
resignation with the IMCA; prepare, sign, and publicly post a similar 
affidavit, stating that she will never, ever, sell, buy, barter, or 
trade meteorites in the United States, or elsewhere, for as long as she 
may live!
3).  Maria Haas, the current Treasurer of the IMCA, will tender her 
resignation with the IMCA, prepare, sign, and publicly post a similar 
affidavit, stating, that she will never, ever, sell, buy, barter, or 
trade meteorites in the United States, or elsewhere, for as long as she 
may live!
4).  Mr. Blaine Reed, an IMCA member, will, without hesitation, tender 
his resignation with the IMCA, prepare, sign, and publicly post a 
similar affidavit, stating, that he will never, ever, sell, buy, 
barter, or trade meteorites, in the United States, or elsewhere, for as 
long as he may live!
5).  The following members, or affiliates of the IMCA, will tender 
their resignations with the IMCA, effective immediately!  These 
members, and/or affiliates, will also prepare, sign, and publicly post 
"Letters of Apologies" to Mr. Curry, his family, and colleagues.  They 
will, also, tender similar affidavits, stating, that they will never, 
ever, sell, buy, barter, or trade meteorites in the United States, or 
elsewhere, for as long as they may live!
A).  Michael Blood, San Diego; Walter Newton, Conifer, CO; Sonny Clary, 
Las Vegas, NV; Geoff Notkin, Tucson, AZ, Steve Arnold, Fayetteville, 
AR; Matt Morgan, Denver, CO; Steve Arnold, Chicago, IL; Count Deiro, 
Los Angeles, CA; Sterling Webb, UKN; Walter Perry, UKN; and Ken Newton, 
(a.k.a "Magellon"), UKN.
6).  Surviving members of the IMCA will demand a purge of all members 
associated with any attacks upon Mr. Curry's integrity, character, and 
research!  These members will demand a full-scale restructuring of the 
IMCA to the high standards set in the original charter of this 
organization.
7).  The following scientists, having collaborated with, consorted 
with, and confederated with IMCA members to unfairly control the market 
place, and the actual supply of genuine & authenticatable meteorites; 
particularly Lunar meteorites, will tender their resignations to their 
home universities; effective immediately.  These scientists will, 
without hesitation, tender "Letters of Apology," to Mr. Curry, his 
family, and colleagues.  These scientists will, also, prepare, sign, 
and publicly post similar affidavits, stating, that they will never, 
ever, analyze another meteorite in the United States, or elsewhere, for 
as long as they may live!


   Dr. Randy Korotev, WUSTL; Dr. Carl Agee, UNM; Dr. Lawrence Garvie, 
ASU, Dr. Alex Ruzika, Cascadia Meteorite Lab, Portland State 
University, Dr. John T. Wasson, UCLA, Dr. Alan Rubin, UCLA, Dr. Michael 
Zolensky, NASA's JSC, Dr. Timothy McCoy, Smithsonian Institute; Dr. 
Arthur Elmann, TCU; Dr. Rainer Newberry, UA at Fairbanks; Dr. Chris 
Peterson, Caltech/Denver Museum of Nature & Science; Dr. Theodore 
Bunch, NAU; Dr. John Wittke, NAU; and Melinda Hutson, Cascadia 
Meteorite Lab, Portland State University.


    Should it be found, that our "Uncompahgre Lunar Feldspathic 
Breccia" does not match, in any way, shape, or form, to Mr. Hupe's "NWA 
5000," or to that of the Apollo Lunar Samples of Feldspathic Breccias, 
or meteorites posted with the Lunar & Planetary Institute's "Lunar 
Meteorite Compendium," Mr. Curry will, without hesitation, close his 
Ebay posting of the "Uncompahgre Lunar Meteorite," permanently, and 
forever.  Mr. Curry will also initiate a "Public Letter of Apology" to 
Mr. Hupe, members of the IMCA, and to above named scientists.


IMPORTANT NOTE:  The decision to engage, or not to engage, in this 
"invitation to participate" in this "High Noon in Western Colorado," 
will not be a joint decision of the IMCA members, nor made by the above 
scientists.  The decision will be made by one individual, and one 
individual, only!  That, one, individual will be Mr. Adam Hupe!  Mr. 
Hupe will be held responsible, and accountable for, all consequences of 
his actions, or inactions!  This includes any & all complaints, and all 
attempts of litigation, stemming from Mr. Hupe's decision!  
    Should Mr. Hupe decide not to engage in this "Scientific XRF Duel," 
Mr. Curry will consider his work, research, character, and integrity 
vindicated and exonerated.  By "default," Mr. Hupe, the involved 
members of the IMCA, and the listed scientists, will be bound by this 
"default," to issue "Letters of Apology" to Mr. Curry, and tender 
affidavits, stating they will "cease & desist" their operations of all 
sales, trades, barters, and purchases of meteorites, for as long as 
they may live!  They will, also, be bound by this "default," to tender 
their resignations to the IMCA, effective immediately!  
   The listed scientists will, also, be bound by this "default," and 
will sign & issue an affidavit, stating that they will never, again, 
analyze another meteorite, for as long as they may live!  These 
scientists will, also, tender their resignations with their parent 
universities.


   In all fairness to Mr. Hupe, and knowing that he is not a scientist, 
I will offer the following "evidence," clearly indicating that our 
"Uncompahgre Lunar Feldspathic Breccia" is, not only, of 
extraterrestrial origins, but, it is of Lunar origins; as described & 
published by a number of "esteemed" scientists.  For those individuals 
who need to see Ni, in a specimen, in order to classify the specimen as 
extraterrestrial, I've highlighted these just for you!
   As an alternative, or option, in accepting, or declining my 
challenge, Mr. Hupe is welcome to bid on, or purchase one, or both, of 
these specimens, at the current retail price listed on my Ebay 
postings.  All transactions must be completed through Ebay channels, so 
if Mr. Hupe, or anyone else, is interested in the 6.0kg "Uncompahgre 
Lunar Feldspathic Breccia," just let me know, and I will get it posted!


Specimen #1: (394 grams) As posted on Ebay: Au (-9), Pt (29), Ag (-6), 
Pd (-6), Fe (5,575), Zr (138), Sr (606), Rb (54), Pb (26), Zn (20), Cu 
(156), Ni (66), Co (114), Ba (582), Cs (310).


Specimen #2: (6.0kgs); Au (-9), Pt (41), Ag (-7), Pd (-7), Fe (10.4K), 
Zr (180), Sr (491), Rb (69), Th (9), Pb (62), Ni (65), Co (240), Mn 
(4,402), Ba (998), Cs (151).


   For Mr. Hupe, and for those who may need assistance in recognizing 
extraterrestrial debris, as in meteorites, I am providing the following 
link for your perusal, and continuing education.  It is obvious, that 
most IMCA members, could use a bit of continuing education!


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asteroid_mining


 
Cheers & Bona Petite!
Steve