[meteorite-list] Shirokovsky

Sun Aug 21 02:04:04 EDT 2011

This list is odd, I bet that when news of an amazing new meteorite breaks In the next couple of days, no one will give a crap. Let's see........ 
100 posts on a 10 year old scam vs 10 or so on new fall.

Michael Farmer

Sent from my iPhone

On Aug 21, 2011, at 8:59 AM, Pete Pete <rsvp321 at hotmail.com> wrote:

> 
> 
> 
> With this crap currently selling for a minimum $1.00 US per gram, no doubt the culprit(s) are wondering which engine block to melt next.
> 
> 
> 
> In this case, crime seems to pay.
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Pete
> 
> 
> 
>> From: lintonius at earthlink.net
>> To: mexicodoug at aim.com
>> Date: Sat, 20 Aug 2011 22:46:21 -0700
>> CC: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Shirokovsky
>> 
>> Greetings listoids.
>> Doug, I believe you've introduced an important distinction, upon which I've 
>> been intending on opining. Like you said, "a meteorwrong by most 
>> definitions is *natural* material than can be confused with an authentic 
>> meteorite out in the field." Shirokovsky, on the other hand, was a 
>> deliberate fake. A man-made concoction for the sole purpose of fraud. (Based 
>> on what I've read here.) I can understand the interest in a legitimate 
>> meteorwrong - I bought a piece of Mendota myself - but, in my opinion, 
>> Shirokovsky does not deserve to be in that category. I would be no more 
>> likely to purchase a sample, than to intentionally purchase counterfeit 
>> currency. It has about the same worth.
>> But while I have to agree with Adam's point of view on this, I can somewhat 
>> understand the opposing views. Respect them, anyway. Interestingly though, 
>> most all of those in favor of collecting it, already have it in their 
>> collections. A case of "sour grapes", in reverse? ;^)
>> Just my two cents. Actual value may vary.
>> Linton
>> 
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "MexicoDoug" <mexicodoug at aim.com>
>> To: <raremeteorites at yahoo.com>; <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
>> Sent: Friday, August 19, 2011 6:51 PM
>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Shirokovsky
>> 
>> 
>>> Adam wrote:
>>> 
>>> "I see Shirokovsky as being off topic"
>>> 
>>> I agree and would keep my mouth shut iof I thought it were an innocent 
>>> scam that was over and reparations made.
>>> 
>>> Since I agree with Adam as such this will be my only post, since what is 
>>> on topic, interestingly, is clarifying that it is not a 
>>> eteorwrong*.. - a meteorwrong by most definitions is natural material 
>>> than can be confused with an authentic meteorite out in the field. This 
>>> is not that case, this is the case of the apple colored moldavites faked 
>>> on eBay. This is a *PSEUDOMETEORITE* and that term is doing it a favor, 
>>> and we should IMO all be very clear about that for the mutual benefit of 
>>> all of our collections and future material that could enter them.
>>> 
>>> Shirokovsky may elicit the Pavlovian Dogs salivation in collectors that 
>>> haven't been soiled by it. You know - save that salivation for the real 
>>> stuff, Shirokovsky isn't even in the category of a blow-up meteorite doll. 
>>> There is nothing technologically interesting about Shirokovsky, the matrix 
>>> is nothing better than you can find in a cheap faux bead shop, and why 
>>> people think it would have an etch pattern is beyond me. The only reason 
>>> to have it is because when you drive by an accident on the highway and see 
>>> an accident with blood and guts, you have to stop and cause everyone else 
>>> a traffic jam as you gawk. And then you have to tell everyone else, yes, 
>>> look I have a piece of that corpse on the road, look at me!
>>> 
>>> I wouldn't feel this way at all if the story were all closed and those who 
>>> have lost hundreds of thousands of dollars (yes, the amount is correct) 
>>> were ok and the crooks in jail. But the collective memory seems to mean 
>>> nothing even if we can learn from our past. Everything would be cool in 
>>> the collectible category if there were a fixed amount of Shirokovsky out 
>>> there.
>>> 
>>> It is not all accounted for and it gives someone else the idea of 
>>> manufacturing other meteorites; why, instead of getting locked up for 
>>> stealing from several collectors and causing all kinds of business 
>>> heartache beyond the active imagination of many listmembers, the message 
>>> is clear. Make a Shitpkovsky fake, if you get caught, be nowhere to be 
>>> found and burn the people who trusted you, cause a great deal of 
>>> pollutuion that everyone else has to clean up (the equivalent of the Exxon 
>>> Valdez, and we all cleaned it up), and then appear 10 years later selling 
>>> more of it like war memorabilia from the dark side and getting people to 
>>> actually argue it is a good thing to have in collections.
>>> 
>>> Huuumpt. I still remember being at a function 3 years ago where the big 
>>> meteorite dealer insisted to an ignorant crowd that his many Shirokovsky 
>>> pseudometeorites. He sold them for $25/g and many just three years ago 
>>> painted me as someone who didn't know since he was the expert (ha).
>>> 
>>> Here's what the serious problem is: the material was all controlled before 
>>> by the dealer terrorists and collector rapists. If you bought a piece of 
>>> this suckerite from one of the original good faith dealers, you did a fine 
>>> thing to help bail them out and had the cute thing to discuss it in a 
>>> charitable show and tell. But - Now assigning a collection value to new 
>>> material all you are doing is having money chase the masses that were 
>>> never cut. And as we all know, when money chases, money gets. And - 
>>> guess where this new material is coming from?
>>> 
>>> Kindest wishes
>>> Doug
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Adam Hupe <raremeteorites at yahoo.com>
>>> To: Adam <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
>>> Sent: Fri, Aug 19, 2011 5:38 pm
>>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Shirokovsky
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I guess collecting artifacts has made me leery about fakes. Get caught 
>>> with one
>>> fake artifact and it will put your entire collection in question. It is 
>>> best to
>>> get artifacts papered and destroy any that have been "killed" by an 
>>> independent
>>> authenticator. I see Shirokovsky as being off topic since it is not a 
>>> meteorite
>>> and is was only produced in order to defraud honest collectors out of 
>>> their hard
>>> earned money.
>>> If you want a piece of a recycled old Ford motor block in your collection, 
>>> that
>>> is your business. To me, it is garbage and so are the people who produced 
>>> it!
>>> 
>>> Adam
>>> 
>> 
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