[meteorite-list] NWA 6292 (BRA) IS paired to NWA 5400 !

Tue Sep 28 12:16:37 EDT 2010

Pairings are found throughout, regardless if found or witnessed. It is just that 
falls require much less scrutiny since the find location is enough to make a 
pairing conclusion. The pairings are very rarely recorded for a fall after the 
initial entry in the bulletin.  NWAs on the other hand, require much more study 
to determine pairings.  The find locations are known for most NWA meteorites, 
same for any other area of mass concentrations. The Nomads and hunters go back 
to these same locations time and time again.  Sometimes the shifting sands 
reveal more material. Same for dry lake beds and Antarctic finds.  They are 
named the same way as NWAs regardless whether coordinates are given or not.  
They are all given serial numbers following the nomenclature.

It doesn't make one rarer than the other.  It could be argued that a lot of 
pairings are lost with time making the TKW for finds less than that of falls.  
It cannot be concluded that one is rarer than the other due to nomenclature 
alone.

The TKWs given for falls are way off unless they came in as a single stone.  One 
just needs to look at Park Forest where the weights were recorded in the 
Meteoritical Bulletin before the main mass and many others were found.

Best Regards,

Adam

----- Original Message ----
From: Shawn Alan <photophlow at yahoo.com>
To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
Sent: Tue, September 28, 2010 8:45:40 AM
Subject: [meteorite-list] NWA 6292 (BRA) IS paired to NWA 5400 !

Adam wrote:

***********************************************************************************

This issue is not unique to NWA meteorites. The same thing could be said for 
Antarctic or other desert finds. Yes, Antarctica is a desert. The same issue 
applies to falls. How much Allende is really out there? Nobody knows for sure, 
the same can be said for Murchison. You can make the same claim for just about 
any fall.

***********************************************************************************

Adam the difference between NWAs and all the other falls is that NWA nobody 
knows where the strewn fields are. As for the rest, there is data on strewn 
fields and correct documentation that is used to asses the fall or find. 

But with a NWA I find that people say that only buy my NWA because its the real 
deal and the pairs are inferior. The problem with that is with NWAs are 
collected and through out the months or year the same meteorite gets recycled 
back to dealers and in a since every NWA stone has to be classified cause of the 
collection process. 

Good example is NWA 2999, I think this meteorite has 2 other pairings if not 
more and think how many pairs it will have in a few years from now? And another 
good example is NWA 5400 which could have a few pairs, which are very likely. 

Now when people bank of there NWA as being rare cause of low TKW it seems that 
it this could be misleading cause of the circumstances that NWAs present to 
science and they way they are collected.

Shawn Alan 
IMCA 1633 
eBaystore 
http://shop.ebay.com/photophlow/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=&_trksid=p4340 

[meteorite-list] NWA 6292 (BRA) IS paired to NWA 5400 !Adam Hupe raremeteorites 
at yahoo.com 

Tue Sep 28 09:22:26 EDT 2010 

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Shawn wrote: 

***************************************************************** 
Now the slight problem I have with NWA's is that you really don't know how much 
of that stuff is out there. That can work in your favor and against you. So 
lets say you found an NWA and its about 1000g and you get it tested and its a 
new NWN. Now you can say its rare because there is only 1000g, but do you 
really know that for sure? From what I have seen, its not the case, and NWAs 
keep getting paired with each other more time then not.... I think that's why I 
tend to stay away from NWA's for that reason and others. 

**************************************************************** 

This issue is not unique to NWA meteorites. The same thing could be said for 
Antarctic or other desert finds. Yes, Antarctica is a desert. The same issue 
applies to falls. How much Allende is really out there? Nobody knows for sure, 
the same can be said for Murchison. You can make the same claim for just about 
any fall. I have seen collectors financially burned on falls many times, myself 
among them. I have lost more value by collecting new falls than I have 
collecting finds. This is why I tend to stay away from new falls. The price 
drops off sharply within a few months once the initial excitement disappears. 

I lost a small fortune on New Orleans and Claxton by letting the market 
determine the value by putting them up for auction with no reserves. 

Happy Hunting, Long live the finds because without them we would have no lunar 
meteorites, 

Adam 

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Hello Greg S and Listers, 

Now the slight problem I have with NWA's is that you really don't know how much 
of that stuff is out there. That can work in your favor and against you. So lets 
say you found an NWA and its about 1000g and you get it tested and its a new 
NWN. Now you can say its rare because there is only 1000g, but do you really 
know that for sure? From what I have seen, its not the case, and NWAs keep 
getting paired with each other more time then not.... I think that's why I tend 
to stay away from NWA's for that reason and others. Plus it seems that every 
meteorite is unique in its own right and some bank off that uniqueness and 
rarity to pump up the price in the NWA market. But once more is found, that type 
isn't that rare anymore, so that's why I stick with the historic falls, cause 
that event can only happen once and there is a rich history and legacy to back 
up that meteorite. 

Also the NWA 5400 is speculated to have a connection with Earth. Now in my own 
opinion if this was the find of the century, wouldn't you think there would be 
more research papers written about this monumental find that some people praise 
it to be? All I can find are 2 papers and the second paper doesn't even seem 
that promising. Good example is Almahata Sitta. That meteorite has been around 
since NWA 5400 and there is so much information and papers upon papers about 
this meteorite, and the research hasn't stop, but for the NWA 5400, its is a 
trickle, 2 papers whats up with that? Again, the evidence isnt there and a 
swashy thought out theory, which other theories have been brough up about the 
NWA 5400 and where it came from, more evidence please.  

But at the end of the day people have their reasons why they collect and some 
are drawn to classifications and others to historic falls. The good thing for 
any collector is to do research and learn what they are going to buy before they 
buy it. Also they learn alot more about meteorites in the process and gain a 
since of understanding of where meteorites came to be. 

If any one has the time, check out this link below, its a great paper written by 
Ursula B. Marvin, explaining the beginning of meteorites from a historical and 
scientific perspective. 

http://adsabs.harvard.edu/full/1996M%26PS...31..545M 

Shawn Alan 

IMCA 1633 
eBaystore 
http://shop.ebay.com/photophlow/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=&_trksid=p4340 

[meteorite-list] NWA 6292 (BRA) IS paired to NWA 5400 !Thunder Stone 
stanleygregr at hotmail.com 

Mon Sep 27 18:48:32 EDT 2010 

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Wow - this is making my head spin.  It is my understanding that the O isotope 
data is necessary to show the relationship to the early earth-type rocks; it has 
to fall on the TFL.  I would think this is necessary to prove a "pairing" to NWA 
5400.  Until then, it is not 100% certain.  The fact that NWA 6292 IS paired to 
5400 suggests that there could be more of this unique meteorite out there. 

Just my thoughts, 

Greg S. 

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