[meteorite-list] Bogus indochinites? Are they or aren't they?

[Sean T. Murray]

Thanks Dirk - -

It's fantastic to get tektite material that is documented and clearly from 
the correct region.
Given the shiping costs, material, and provenance it is a great deal!  Much 
cheaper than getting it from the eBay sources I have found to date...

Sean

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "drtanuki" <drtanuki at yahoo.com>
To: "Mark Ford" <mark.ford at ssl.gb.com>; 
<meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
Sent: Friday, February 13, 2009 7:14 AM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Bogus indochinites? Are they or aren't they?


> Dear Mark and List,
>  You are correct that it is unlikely that tektites are faked, 99.99% BUT 
> NOT 100%.  Rare types such as buttons etc., rare types or rare localities 
> perhaps would be the most likely target because of profit vs effort.
>
>  I have seen ONE intentionally faked tektite in the Philippines in the 
> Late Dr. Beyer`s collection from the 1930~40s (labeled as 'fake'- it was 
> two real tektites that had been affixed together with asphalt to form a 
> very unusual shape).
>
>  Moldavite faked- see ebay and check especially China, Hong Kong sellers.
> "Faked" (mis-represented or mis-identified) Libyan glass...we saw it 
> before from China.
>
>  It is NOT uncommon to see slag substituted as Indochinite.
>
> In my opinion "Indochinite" is not a good name as it allows for such a 
> large area and they may not all be from the same source impact crater or 
> same impact event.  We have yet to find a source crater or craters!
>
>  I am also of the opinion that there were multiple impacts at the time of 
> their formation and the term "Indochinite" is a term left for orphaned 
> tektites that the find location is no longer known or the person obtaining 
> them bought them from persons unwilling to give the find location for 
> financial reasons OR the seller just did not know and assumed that the 
> location was what the local seller said.
>
>  For example, in Thailand, Vietnam, Hong Kong and especially China there 
> are many tektites that are sold as being from China or Thailand when in 
> fact they were imported from Thailand, Laos, Cambodia, Vietnam and even 
> the Philippines).
>
>  In Bangkok, and elsewhere, many of the sellers (merchants) have never 
> been to the field and rely on their contacts (suppliers) to obtain them. 
> True information (fact) in Asia, and in most of the real world, comes at a 
> cost and it does not pay the merchant to advertise for his competitors or 
> customers the location of his source.
>
>  I personally will not willingly give the exact location for the tektites 
> that I have collected to amateurs or "dealers" so that they can further 
> enhance their profits and further deplete scientifically valuable find 
> information.
>
>  I will give accurate information as to country and Provence (IF I am 100% 
> certain only) and that I have seen for myself and collected myself from 
> the location (without the help of "guides" that steer you to their "find 
> site" for a profit.
>  I do give accurate find location to scientists and other researchers that 
> have a reason to know the accurate GPS locations for the tektites that I 
> have found myself or persons that I know have found while with me in the 
> field.
>
> I have seen faked find sites in Asia for tektites and am sure as long as 
> there is a profit some humans will seek to profit from misinformation.
>
>  Bogus tektites are usuallsubstituteded slag, black rocks or augite that 
> have been intentionally added or were found in the field by the locals. 
> In some cases some local sellers "specialize" in slag tektites and their 
> customers have no idea what a tektite should look like. In China, I was 
> shown slag by several dealers- it is not that they were perhaps 
> intenionally trying to cheat me- perhaps they had never seen a tektite and 
> they were sold the material as a tektite. Other cases the dealer knows 
> exactly that he is selling slag and it is up to the buyer to buy or not. 
> Buyer beware!
>
>  Enough of my ramblings; time for sleep after more than a day of being 
> awake.  IF someone wishes to discuss this topic further contact me off 
> list. I am sure Norman can also comment on his experiences IF he is 
> computer-available in Africa.
>
> Best regards, Dirk Ross...Tokyo
>
> BTW: Thank you to all the the some 35 persons that contacted me about 
> buying tektites in the past 13+ hours; special thanks to the 25+ list 
> members that bought!  There are still several kilos left if anyone is 
> interested.
>
>
>
>
> --- On Fri, 2/13/09, Mark Ford <mark.ford at ssl.gb.com> wrote:
>
>> From: Mark Ford <mark.ford at ssl.gb.com>
>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Bogus indochinites?  Are they or aren't 
>> they?
>> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
>> Date: Friday, February 13, 2009, 8:09 PM
>> I don't think assuming 'no one would bother faking
>> something' is the
>> same as meaning they never will, or that something else is
>> consiquentaly
>> genuine because of the low likely hood.
>>
>> This is like applying the same logic that some doctors use,
>> when they
>> say 'you don't have X wrong with you because its
>> 'very unlikely'
>>
>>  The market for indochinites world wide is colossal there
>> are thousands
>> and thousands of gem shops world wide to sell to, believe
>> me they [do]
>> fake tektites, and I doubt most everyday people would even
>> know the
>> difference, if they can make a ton of tektites for a few
>> dollars then it
>> is worth it. Recycled glass is very cheap...
>>
>> Anyway not wishing to cause panic here, I'm fairly
>> confident 99%+ of
>> tektites are perfectly ok, just be careful buying from
>> people you don't
>> know about is all.
>>
>>
>
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