[meteorite-list] -2 arrested update (Dude-- Where's My Caredition)

Fri Apr 3 03:03:01 EDT 2009

Dave,

This reminds me of when I was in  Park Forest, actually in Steger, IL, 6 
years ago this week, where a local man  had his rear window of his car knocked out 
by a meteorite.  I asked him if  he wanted to sell the meteorite, and he made 
it plain to me that he would not  sell it for ANY price. 

Taking him at his word, I dropped the subject and  I then asked him if he 
might be interested in selling the shattered broken glass  from the impact?  To 
which he said he very well might, and then asked what  I would offer him for 
it.  I delayed in giving him an answer on the spot,  and returned to talk with 
him a couple of days later, possibly to close the deal  for the glass.

When I got back with him, he informed me that he had just  sold the meteorite 
that day.  When I asked for how much, it was something  in the neighborhood 
of $8 a gram, maybe $350 for the 40 ish gram  stone.

Trying not to look too upset, I reminded the guy that he had told  me that he 
would not be willing to sell it for ANY price.  He said  "Yea, but I had no 
idea anyone would pay THAT much for it, I just couldn't say  no" he told me.

I was too sick to let him know I would have gladly paid  him 4 times that 
much, maybe even more.

But it was my lesson to learn  that just because some people say "no" it 
doesn't always mean  "no!"

Sometimes they fib to start the negotiations at a better spot.  Sometimes 
they do in fact mean "No" as was the case with me and the Caldwell,  Kansas 
stone.   Sometimes they just don't know what they are saying  "no" to!

Should I have risked offending the man and had pressed him with  a $1,000 
offer for his rock?  Or at least a $400 offer???

Steve  Arnold
Arkansas

***********************

In a message dated  4/2/2009 11:36:57 P.M. Central Daylight Time, 
carothersdl at gmail.com  writes:
Steve,

You asked:  "So why do you still think that I  think he OWES me an 
explanation?"

As I stated in my last post, it  comes from comments like "Often times, 
people have very valid  objections.  Other times, they don't." or "Sometimes 
they will say they  don't want you to hunt because 23 years ago, a fisherman 
left a gate open  and some cows got out.  But usually that isn't a valid 
reason for never  letting anyone ever come on their land again."  Another 
comment you  made regarding the issue of asking to search a property was: 
"Granted,  people lie." Well, maybe they do, but the point is, so what?  It's 

their property and they don't need to explain past the answer...  No.

When you say things like the above, in the context of trying to get  
permission to search a property from a land owner, what is being implied is  
that 1) the person owes you an explanation and 2) if the person does give  
you a reason, that reason must somehow be validated as being reasonable by  
you.

I apologize if I'm reading way too much into this, but I've run  into a 
similar situation and maybe that's why I'm sensitive to this. I've  had 
people wanting to buy property from me and they just won't take a simple  NO! 
for an answer.  They too want to ask the question "Why won't you  sell it to 
us".  I'm sorry, but I don't owe them or anyone else an  explanation.  Even 
if I did provide an explanation, what then?   They try to tell me why I'm 
"wrong" and should sell to them.  That to  me is being arrogant.

One last item.  I did not, nor would I ever  say or imply that you were rude 
or that your conversations with land owners  are contentious or anything like 
that.  From all accounts, you have a  stellar (no pun intended) rep.  I thank 
you too for your courteous  replies.

Regards,

Dave

----- Original Message -----  
From: <MeteorHntr at aol.com>
To: <carothersdl at gmail.com>;  <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
Sent: Thursday, April 02, 2009  10:37 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] -2 arrested update (Dude-- Where's My  
Caredition)

Dave,

You said:

"I thank you for the  detailed explanation,  but I still have issue with your
idea that a land  owner would owe you an  explanation other than "No" when
asked to search  their property."

When I clearly stated in my last post:

"Does  he have an  obligation to tell me why he said no?  Of course  not.  And
did I even  imply that he was obligated to?  But if  you don't ask, often you
don't get  an answer."

*****

So  why do you still think that I think he OWES me an  explanation?

I  don't think he owes me to let me hunt on his land, but I still ask.

He  didn't owe me an explanation, but I still asked for one.

Besides, if  someone owes you something, you demand, you don't ask.

I didn't demand  anything, I just asked.  I wasn't rude. He wasn't  rude.   He
didn't kick me off his driveway. He didn't even ask me to  leave nor  did he
end the conversation.  We had a short, 3 minute talk,  then  I left when it 
was
evident he didn't care if meteorites would be   lost.  Maybe if I offered him
$10,000 in exchange for hunting, he  might  have become interested.  Then 
again,
if he had a  $500,000 "crop" out in the  trees growing, $10,000 for  hunting
privileges wouldn't have probably interested  him  either.

I didn't waste his whole day, he was doing some work, and he kept  working
while I was talking.

Now, maybe someone talked with him before  I did and offended him  in such a
way that he was sour to not me  personally, but to "meteorite hunters"  in
general.  That could  have been the case.  And it was, I would  have loved to 

have
found that out.

But since he didn't say that, or give any  reason, I just don't know.

Besides, I ended up hunting on one of his  neighbors ground the next day
where we found the 1,673g specimen the day  before the rains, so maybe it was 
a
blessing that he said "No," and that  he didn't tell me why, and that I 
didn't
overcome his  objections?

Then again, I might have changed his mind and I might have  found 5 kilo 
rock
on his ground instead.

Who knows?  It is  all "water under the bridge", or should I say "rocks 
under
the mud"  now.

Steve

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