WG: [meteorite-list] meteorite prices

Jörn Koblitz koblitz at microfab.de
Thu Nov 4 13:39:03 EST 2004 

Dear Greg,

I agree. For dealers, mainly as they have to pay tax, it makes a difference. 

Classification costs 20g of material plus shipping plus waiting. It probably pays off only for bigger specimens.

Jörn

> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: Greg Hupe [mailto:gmhupe at tampabay.rr.com]
> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 4. November 2004 20:21
> An: Jörn Koblitz
> Cc: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] meteorite prices
> 
> 
> Hello Jorn,
> 
> What dealers pay wholesale and what collectors of smaller 
> specimens pay are 
> entirely different. If I purchased a stone for $2.00 per gram 
> and offered it 
> intact for $3.00 per gram, fine. But, if I wanted to offer 
> it, classified, 
> to all collectors, I could not offer it at the $2.00 price, I 
> would have all 
> of the associated expenses involved in offering a CLASSIFIED 
> meteorite. 
> Therefore, asking $5.00 a gram or more is not unexpected 
> (just an example, 
> no known meteorite represented).
> 
> Best regards,
> 
> Greg
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Jörn Koblitz" <koblitz at microfab.de>
> To: "Bernhard Rems" <rendelius at rpgdot.com>
> Cc: <Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
> Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 12:03 PM
> Subject: AW: [meteorite-list] meteorite prices
> 
> 
> Bernhard: I agree. Could be a scenario for the near future.
> 
> Martin: I think you are correct in your analysis regarding 
> the Moroccan 
> dealers. However, I think that they serve mainly the other - 
> specialized - 
> meteorite dealers on a wholesale basis. Their presence at 
> mineral fairs like 
> Munich is nice and there they will also reach serious 
> collectors like you, 
> but I assume that the "big deals" are already done, either in 
> Morocco or at 
> the first day, when the mineral show isn't open to the 
> public. That's what I 
> was frequently told by other (specialized) dealers. These 
> "specialized" 
> meteorite dealer serve the retail market, including eBay. My 
> impression is 
> that most medium-rare types like eucrites, howardites, 
> ureilites are sold 
> around 10 to 20$/g. Only in few instances - often with larger 
> pieces - 
> prices of less than 5$/g are realized. In Munich, I was lucky 
> to buy a 100g 
> individual of a howardite (paired with NWA 1929) from a 
> Moroccan dealer (he 
> knew what he sold!) for just 2.5 $/g. The same material - a 
> slice of about 1 
> grams just went on ebay for about 20$/g. I always wonder, who 
> buys at such 
> price levels. Probably, those, who do not have the chance to 
> visit mineral 
> fairs like Munich, Ensisheim or Tucson.
> 
> Jörn
> 
> 
> > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> > Von: Bernhard Rems [mailto:rendelius at rpgdot.com]
> > Gesendet: Donnerstag, 4. November 2004 18:39
> > An: Jörn Koblitz
> > Cc: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> > Betreff: AW: [meteorite-list] meteorite prices
> >
> >
> > My theory (and I might be wrong):
> >
> > The number of "occasional" collectors will continue to grow.
> > Occasional
> > in this regard means that they will try to build a 
> collection, but are
> > limited on the amount of money they WANT to spend on a 
> piece. I'd say
> > 95% of the collectors out there now have a limit of $100-200 of what
> > they are willing to pay for a single piece. They will never 
> buy a 600g
> > Brahin or a 5g martian (well, on very rare occasions, maybe).
> >
> > The "high price market" will grow much slower than this entry level
> > segment. It will grow as well, since some of the entry 
> levellers will
> > become passionate collectors.
> >
> > So the shortage of OC's that could happen soon could have 
> two effects:
> > prices will rise in relation to the "better" meteorites, and
> > sold pieces
> > will become smaller.
> >
> > I predict that the boom markets for meteorites will be the 
> OC markets
> > and micromounts of rarer meteorites.
> >
> > Bernhard
> >
> > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> > Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com
> > [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im
> > Auftrag von Jörn
> > Koblitz
> > Gesendet: Donnerstag, 04. November 2004 18:17
> > An: Greg Hupe; Michael Farmer
> > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> > Betreff: AW: [meteorite-list] meteorite prices
> >
> > Certainly, there are many more ordinary chondrites (OCs) 
> from the hot
> > desert and rare types like achondrite probably make up just 
> one or two
> > percent of it...
> >
> > ...but, considering the fairly high prices for the rare 
> types and the
> > limited spending capacity of this market segment (collectors
> > as well as
> > museums/research institutes), my impression is, that OCs are
> > easily sold
> > in "tons" at price levels of 50 to 100$/kg, wereas the rare stuff is
> > being sold on a gram or even milligram scale.
> >
> > Wouldn't it take a very long time, to get all the 
> howardites, polymict
> > eucrites, rumurutiites, martian meteorites (considering 
> alone the TKWs
> > of DaG 476 or SaU 005 and pairings) hiding in the back rooms
> > of Moroccan
> > and non-Moroccan dealers?
> >
> > I assume, that the prices for OCs - especially those with
> > nice shapes or
> > fairly unweathered interior - will rise soon, whereas most 
> of the rare
> > types will stay at high level or will even decline.
> >
> > Any objections?
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Jörn
> >
> > > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> > > Von: Greg Hupe [mailto:gmhupe at tampabay.rr.com]
> > > Gesendet: Donnerstag, 4. November 2004 18:44
> > > An: Michael Farmer
> > > Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> > > Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] ebay auction meteorites
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi Mike,
> > >
> > > I concur! The gold rush is already showing signs of ending.
> > > The Moroccans
> > > are pulling out their "good" material and acting in a
> > > feverish, money lust,
> > > frenzy to get the last buck from those who deal there.
> > >
> > > Greg
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > > From: "Michael Farmer" <meteoritehunter at comcast.net>
> > > To: "Martin Altmann" <Altmann at Meteorite-Martin.de>; "MARK BOSTICK"
> > > <thebigcollector at msn.com>; <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
> > > Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 10:27 AM
> > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] ebay auction meteorites
> > >
> > >
> > > > On two expeditions in Oman, we found over 100 meteorites
> > > before finding my
> > > > first achondrite, a rare type of Ureilite.
> > > > Achondrites are rare, the flood from Morocco will soon end.
> > > > Mike Farmer
> > > > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > > > From: "Martin Altmann" <Altmann at Meteorite-Martin.de>
> > > > To: "MARK BOSTICK" <thebigcollector at msn.com>;
> > > > <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
> > > > Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 7:19 AM
> > > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] ebay auction meteorites
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >> Hiho Mark,
> > > >>
> > > >> the region does not make the difference, the finders do!
> > > >>
> > > >> In Antarctica it's the common process, to number each
> > > stone seperately -
> > > >> take a look at the Bulletins, there you'll find rare
> > > types, found in the
> > > >> same place on the same day with different numbers.
> > > >> Sahara in general is different, in Oman never were so much
> > > hunters around
> > > >> as
> > > >> in Libya and the Oman stuff does not end up in Morocco.
> > > >> And the teams in Oman give always all their finds from one
> > > aerea as a
> > > >> bunch
> > > >> in classification, most in the same place. So different
> > > conditions as
> > > >> with
> > > >> the NWA-stuff.
> > > >> Meanwhile a beginning collector must have the 
> impression, that a
> > > >> howardite,
> > > >> a mesosiderite, a CV3 or a olivine diogenite must be
> > > something extremely
> > > >> common, as always when a new one is coming out, in the
> > > months to follow,
> > > >> appears a dozen numbers of the same material.
> > > >> But ask f.e. Afanasjev or Haberer how many ordinary
> > > chondrites you have
> > > >> to
> > > >> hunt down, until you'll find an achondrite! Make some
> > > stats NWA versus
> > > >> Dho,
> > > >> with the latter I suppose you will get different ratios of
> > > rare types to
> > > >> common ones, if you count the numbers as own finds.
> > > >>
> > > >> And of course many of the OCs from Oman are similar
> > > looking as in most
> > > >> cases, they ae very weathered, W3-4. But take a look in
> > > the lists from
> > > >> the
> > > >> Bulletins, where you can see from the date of find and the
> > > coordinates,
> > > >> that
> > > >> mostly a large series of subsequent numbers were found on
> > > the same trip,
> > > >> there you have a wide variety of Ls and Hs with different
> > > Fa and Fs
> > > >> values
> > > >> and weathering degrees.
> > > >>
> > > >> So I think, if it costs the same, Stevey is not wrong to
> > > prefer Dho
> > > >> instead
> > > >> of NWA, as in my eyes, they have a higher collector's
> > > value (and I'm
> > > >> really
> > > >> no fan of desert chondrites, I'm sooo conservative and
> > > collect names).
> > > >>
> > > >> Cheeers!
> > > >> Martin
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> ----- Original Message ----- 
> > > >> From: "MARK BOSTICK" <thebigcollector at msn.com>
> > > >> To: <Altmann at Meteorite-Martin.de>;
> > > <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
> > > >> Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 2:38 PM
> > > >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] ebay auction meteorites
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>> Hello Martin,
> > > >>>
> > > >>> I do not keep a list of paired meteorites or possible
> > > paired meteorites.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Dhofar is no different then DaG or other like regions.  I
> > > have traded
> > > >>> more
> > > >>> in DaG so I could tell you some pairs in it.  I have seen
> > > a few tables
> > > >>> of
> > > >>> Dhofar's where you have several H5 or L6's that look a
> > lot alike.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> There have been pairing studies done in DaG, Roosvelt
> > County and
> > > >>> Anartica.
> > > >>> In all of these high collection places pairings were
> > > found to be pretty
> > > >>> common.  Which I do not see as any problem and that was
> > > not a negative
> > > >>> Dhofar comment.  Anyone thinking it was negative is free
> > > to send me all
> > > >>> their Roosevelt County meteorites.  Should a pairing
> > > study be made, I
> > > >> think
> > > >>> the numbers say you will find Dhofar no different then
> > > other areas of
> > > >>> meteorite concentration.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> The naming rules in all these areas say pretty much,
> > > unless it fits
> > > >>> together, it gets a different name...or number as it is.
> > > We seem to
> > > >>> have
> > > >>> changed this a little to, found within a few feet, as
> > > many of the DaG's
> > > >> with
> > > >>> the same number do not fit together.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> On my website you will find I have many Dhofar, DaG and
> > other like
> > > >> numbered
> > > >>> meteorites.  However, if you check the gallery, you
> > will see in my
> > > >> personal
> > > >>> collection, I avoid like classification meteorites from
> > > regions of high
> > > >>> meteorite concentration.
> > > >>>
> > > >>> http://www.meteoritearticles.com/photogallerymeteorites.html
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Mark Bostick
> > > >>> www.meteoritearticles.com
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>> ______________________________________________
> > > >>> Meteorite-list mailing list
> > > >>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> > > >>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> > > >>
> > > >> ______________________________________________
> > > >> Meteorite-list mailing list
> > > >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
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> > > >>
> > > >
> > > >
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